Counter Skills

The Counter skills should always make you go last and will counter the last skill that hit you(except Martyrdom from ally).

Water Spout
Magic Mirror
Mirror Shield

That would defeat the purpose. Those moves take damage and return it, but doesn't work if you're dead. S if you use the move your first turn it won't activate till the next one, and chances are most monsters are dead after 2 solid hits so the move won't even activate. They HAVE to go first.

S if you use the move your first turn it won't activate till the next one,

It should activate on the Last Skill(Except from skills by Ally) that hit you.

and chances are most monsters are dead after 2 solid hits so the move won't even activate.

If so , then they only need to be hit once since it's 2 fold for the psychic ones.

They HAVE to go first.

or this , it should have Speed Priority if it is what you are implying , since they don't work if you go slower.

The Counter skills should always make you go last and will counter the last skill that hit you(except Martyrdom from ally).

Water Spout
Magic Mirror
Mirror Shield

agree with junico, but the counters wont rlly work in HM anyway, there is no psychic monster with very high hp and low def and Mdef like wobbuffet.

it should have negative move priority like cunning, attacking last.

S if you use the move your first turn it won't activate till the next one,

It should activate on the Last Skill(Except from skills by Ally) that hit you.

and chances are most monsters are dead after 2 solid hits so the move won't even activate.

If so , then they only need to be hit once since it's 2 fold for the psychic ones.

They HAVE to go first.

or this , it should have Speed Priority if it is what you are implying , since they don't work if you go slower.

God you're dumb. The moves are counters, the whole point of a counter is to be activated before an attack so that it's effect can be activated during and/or directly after an attack. If you use a counter AFTER you were already hit then there IS NOTHING TO COUNTER because you already took the damage. As for speed priority just give it to a fast monster. Yea it'll be nice to have that feature but if they don't (I thought they did) then do the next best thing

Sight rex, counters aren't there to prevent dmg, so it makes no sense to go first. Counters are meant to deal double dmg back, thus they need to receive the dmg first. If counter would go the first turn, it has nothing to counter.

Plz do some research before you call someone dumb. Just google wobbuffet and see why this normal pokemon is considered as an uber pokemon in the competitive tier among the legendary pokemons. Like I said before, counters doesnt work with the monsters in HM, it lacks the monster (very high hp and low def + Mdef) for this build and other half of the supporting skills (encore, destiny bond and shadowtag) needed to make it succeed.

Sight rex, counters aren't there to prevent dmg, so it makes no sense to go first. Counters are meant to deal double dmg back, thus they need to receive the dmg first. If counter would go the first turn, it has nothing to counter.

Plz do some research before you call someone dumb. Just google wobbuffet and see why this normal pokemon is considered as an uber pokemon in the competitive tier among the legendary pokemons. Like I said before, counters doesnt work with the monsters in HM, it lacks the monster (very high hp and low def + Mdef) for this build and other half of the supporting skills (encore, destiny bond and shadowtag) needed to make it succeed.

THIS ISN'T POKEMON! For the love of god stop comparing the two. And if you actually did research you would have noticed that I also mentioned how if you die the move doesn't work, and because those moves only can go on psychic monsters (unless they've changed it) then the best you're going to get is 2 turns. If it goes first you're at least get 1 damage return, if it goes second you won't get any because those moves ONLY work when you were attacked AFTER activation. Here's an example:

Turn one:

Monster A attacks monster B takes damage then uses magic mirror, no damage is returned.

Turn two: monster A attacks monster B dies, no return damage.

That's what you're suggesting, here's how it works when you go first:

Turn one:

Monster B uses mirror monster A attacks and receives double the damage

Turn two:

Monster A attacks kills monster B no damage is returned.


This IS NOT Pokemon, in Pokemon a monster with counter can usually last longer than the psychic types here depending on what Pokemon we're talking about so it works there, here it doesn't. Got it? Good.

"Turn one:

Monster A attacks monster B takes damage then uses magic mirror, no damage is returned."

your first example should be:

Turn one:

Monster A attacks monster B takes damage then uses magic mirror, no damage is returned. ---->
Monster A attacks monster B takes damage then uses magic mirror, dealing double dmg back after receiving the initial dmg.

why does it not return the dmg if counter goes last?

the result of your suggestion and how it works in pokemon are exactly the same, both dealing 2x dmg after surviving an att, only the visual order differs.

what i dont understand is why your first example fails to deal the 2x dmg back.

"Turn one:

Monster A attacks monster B takes damage then uses magic mirror, no damage is returned."

your first example should be:

Turn one:

Monster A attacks monster B takes damage then uses magic mirror, no damage is returned. ---->
Monster A attacks monster B takes damage then uses magic mirror, dealing double dmg back after receiving the initial dmg.

why does it not return the dmg if counter goes last?

the result of your suggestion and how it works in pokemon are exactly the same, both dealing 2x dmg after surviving an att, only the visual order differs.

what i dont understand is why your first example fails to deal the 2x dmg back.

BECAUSE THE MONSTER USUALLY DIES. God why does no one ever read the whole thing. *most* psychic monsters die after 2 hits now thanks to upgraded skills, legendary monsters, and what have you. And it's a proven fact that the mirror moves DO NOT activate the turn the monster dies, so for the fourth time if you go second, 99% of the time you won't be able to have the move work. Haypi would literally need to re-make both moves from scratch to make your suggestion actually make sense

Do you actually read other people's and your own post??

In order for counter to activate monster need to survive the hit right?

Imagine this:
Example 1, counter going last
Monster A deals dmg, monster B takes hit and does double dmg back THE SAME TURN if choose the right counter. All happening n the same turn.

Example 2, counter going first
You suggest, monster B uses counter first, then monster A deals dmg, monster B directly deals 2x dmg back.

The end result of both the examples are the same, regardless of going first or last, they need both to survive the hit.

Hmm, i might figured out why my post doesnt make sense to you. Your interpretation of my post is that the counter dmg activates in the second turn, thus being useless.
What i mean is that example 1 take place in one turn.